tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post4842593176352382010..comments2024-03-13T02:16:08.135-04:00Comments on Cozy Beehive: How Cycling Pro's Defeat Anti-Doping ControlRon Georgehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18394865788996482667noreply@blogger.comBlogger55125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-53047962284964112912013-07-23T13:58:58.141-04:002013-07-23T13:58:58.141-04:00I've read somewhere that it's possible to ...I've read somewhere that it's possible to pick up traces of the plastics in blood bags in a blood sample test. That, of course, would mean storing the blood in some other way, but don't rule out the possibility of detecting stored and re-injected blood. Not that it means that the UCI is taking it seriously...Duncan Parkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17308036078949172749noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-20787671369957331882011-08-09T13:36:30.429-04:002011-08-09T13:36:30.429-04:00Cozy Beehive, your the shiznits! keep it up.Cozy Beehive, your the shiznits! keep it up.paycheck loanhttp://paycheckloantips.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-91687730243446307532011-05-10T05:13:55.079-04:002011-05-10T05:13:55.079-04:00Well can't come as a surprise to anyone, it...Well can't come as a surprise to anyone, it's just we all have been expected for years.<br /><br />regards,<br /><a href="http://www.laanepenge.edu.pl/andre-sider/" rel="nofollow">Låne Penge</a>Michaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05164652688315903472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-22361372953274845232010-02-18T22:58:49.714-05:002010-02-18T22:58:49.714-05:00I'm in the UK & met someone who'd trie...I'm in the UK & met someone who'd tried to become a pro. Had to ask if the doping stories were true & he said yes, absolutely. Also that friends who had ridden for pro teams had been messed up by the doping. And that he knew people who'd given it up when they'd realised that doping was considered essential. I'm not sure that I believe that they ALL do it, but I wouldn't be surprised if some or even most teams insist that riders do as they're told.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-51609657223302646842010-02-18T02:21:51.820-05:002010-02-18T02:21:51.820-05:00Oh shut up smutface above. Everyone makes mistakes...Oh shut up smutface above. Everyone makes mistakes. Joe's gone through a shit lot and basically has learnt to use his maturity to help fight a problem in cycling that even he had himself. You have a problem with people trying to clean up the sport? What do you suggest, we embrace the Omerta? Get a bike and ride it sometime u nut.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-51995531120780495212010-02-17T23:23:23.165-05:002010-02-17T23:23:23.165-05:00Hi, I believe Joe Papp is the worst kind of cheati...Hi, I believe Joe Papp is the worst kind of cheating, doping, piece of shit criminal there is... he is a rat!<br /><br />But I am glad to see he has gotten all self righteous. I cannot believe you would this a soapbox to stand on.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-35722609773601493482010-01-29T07:18:22.255-05:002010-01-29T07:18:22.255-05:00ah yes, but you are aware that the Earth is NOT ro...ah yes, but you are aware that the Earth is NOT round right? <br /><br />Its "Squamish".<br /><br />great article and overall discussion. Fantastic to find somewhere that can talk about this topic without degenerating into baseless liable and slander.<br /><br />One thing though, regarding dear Bernie, its incorrect to imply that somehow it was him that kicked off the GFC. (seems that way in what you wrote). Yes he committed fraud etc but if he is to be seen as a corrupt rider then it is the Banks and US Fed that should be seen as a corrupt and incompetent cycling federation. His fraud would have kept ticking for years if it wasn't for the bank's poor home lending pratcises. <br /><br />But I digress...<br /><br />With the exception of recent cases such as Lance being able to keep the testers waiting while he had a shower, is it really the case that the testers themselves are as corrupt as they potentially were a few years ago? I recall reading recently of someone being tested in public at a resteraunt... sounds a bit the far side of bribable to me...Martynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-7462524645416853092010-01-13T22:35:24.139-05:002010-01-13T22:35:24.139-05:00Liggett,
The flat earth society of cycling are th...Liggett,<br /><br />The flat earth society of cycling are the ones who believe our sport is squeaky clean. You cant ride the Tour de France and other big races on mineral water alone. I'll do my best to strip cycling naked and expose its dirtiness. This is reality.Ron Georgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18394865788996482667noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-35118653788398605532010-01-13T12:10:42.936-05:002010-01-13T12:10:42.936-05:00Fantastic article, Joe and Ron. Very enlightening ...Fantastic article, Joe and Ron. Very enlightening and thanks for sharing!! Please don't be discouraged by the fools with their heads in the sand. Those who believe Lance and Landis race clean also believe the Earth is flat and at the center of the universe. Laughable.Liggett Jr.https://www.blogger.com/profile/06026364422948749472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-32494250815712568222010-01-12T11:08:19.796-05:002010-01-12T11:08:19.796-05:00Ciao Joe!
I know it sounds funny but thats what H...Ciao Joe!<br /><br />I know it sounds funny but thats what Hansen reported.<br />I guess they had some sort of "agreements". ;-)Michelehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16142733708739215656noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-4398726611476300272010-01-11T22:52:14.275-05:002010-01-11T22:52:14.275-05:00He said "No" and that's all it took?...He said "No" and that's all it took?! Darn, I should have thought of that in Turkey! lol/jk. <br /><br />Ciao Michele!JMPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05346798683078093966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-23615955698796109132010-01-11T11:37:26.853-05:002010-01-11T11:37:26.853-05:00Some years ago, Adam Hansen, used to ride for a sm...Some years ago, Adam Hansen, used to ride for a smaller Austrian team and used to visit the a cycling forum. In a topic he reported a "funny" situation happened at a Tour of Austria where the winner of one stages was asked if he wanted to go for the doping control from a doping commissarie but he said "no" and he was free to go.<br />He reported the fact cause that day he got the prize as most combattive cyclist of the day and was there in front of the doping control "office" waiting for go in.<br /><br />Great article and Ive even got the chance to meet Joe at one race while he was in Italy.Michelehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16142733708739215656noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-90567533242230112662010-01-10T23:43:02.985-05:002010-01-10T23:43:02.985-05:00This is an amazing article. It really shows all th...This is an amazing article. It really shows all the dirty little tricks you can employ to cover up cheating, some are so simple as to pee on your hand. One can only wonder what could have been done in the space of time of 20 minutes, ala Lance insisting on taking a shower when the anti-doping folks showed up. Ofcourse, I'm not suggesting he did but you can do but wonder...Willienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-56158673573114044052010-01-10T05:45:37.578-05:002010-01-10T05:45:37.578-05:00if a doping athlete is advised by a top profession...if a doping athlete is advised by a top professional - several are former ad lab employees - it is exceedingly difficult to catch him/her. even by a well designed series of unannounced ooc tests. those caught don't follow instructions well.<br /><br />manipulating dozes and schedules was is and will remain the main method. the idea is to reduce the drugs concentration in the system due to normal (or ‘assisted’) clearance and pass a notoriously unselective screening test.<br /><br />another sure fire option is to take a drug that is not being monitored for. in other words the ad laboratories can not test for something they dont know about (dont have chemical signature of). the various general screening indexes like t/e are almost useless against a designer steroid. worse, steroid profiling is not in the uci biopassport currently.<br /><br />take a note, one multiple tour winner tested positive at least two times retrospectively assuming (rightly) the test did not exist when doping. same with several other big names who were less lucky.rePythonhttp://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=133416#post133416noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-15646937378415783582010-01-09T19:52:48.261-05:002010-01-09T19:52:48.261-05:00"And comparing dopers to Bernie Madoff basica...<b>"And comparing dopers to Bernie Madoff basically ends your attempt to come across as an intelligent person."</b><br /><br />Anon,<br /><br />Fraud is fraud. I cannot sugarcoat it. Let me say this again. Cheating to win and then collecting the big prize money that follows it is unethical and akin to stealing what isn't rightfully yours. If you want to prove it is yours, play clean like the rest of them. Otherwise, lay the money on the table and go do something else for a living. Perhaps Wall Street would accept such swindlers at the trading floor. This goes for cheating racers, their coaches, their directors and the the doctors behind them. Riders alone are not responsible for this sore cancer in our sport.Ron Georgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18394865788996482667noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-21711504460699551552010-01-09T19:23:40.208-05:002010-01-09T19:23:40.208-05:00Bribery is flat out wrong and should come with str...Bribery is flat out wrong and should come with strict punishment for both parties.<br /><br />"Performance Enhancement" itself is a complicated issue that shouldn't be so quickly called "cheating".<br /><br />What happens when artificial body part replacements are actually better than the real thing? Somebody gets in a wreck, needs a new joint, and suddenly becomes disqualified from racing ever again because he's "artificially better than normal"?<br /><br />And comparing dopers to Bernie Madoff basically ends your attempt to come across as an intelligent person.<br /><br />I think you just need to realize that even if everybody was clean, you still couldn't compete among the top end pros. They really are that good.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-65842290674820960072010-01-09T18:21:47.340-05:002010-01-09T18:21:47.340-05:00Indeed phew what an eye-opener. I never knew they ...Indeed phew what an eye-opener. I never knew they went to the extent of having things inserted into their cocks and assholes.texannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-41701067296981623292010-01-09T15:47:36.168-05:002010-01-09T15:47:36.168-05:00You are providing an excellent service to the cycl...You are providing an excellent service to the cycling world. It is guaranteed you won't find something like this in a mainstream cycling publication sponsored by company ads which is pretty sad. I guess you just have to dig out where you want to hear your news from.Xiaonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-45592282584025425112010-01-09T02:44:07.697-05:002010-01-09T02:44:07.697-05:00Anon,
I wouldn't be surprised if next week L...Anon, <br /><br />I wouldn't be surprised if next week <b>LA</b> was revealed as being a doper (w/ irrefutable evidence), but STILL got a pass by playing his trump card: <b>Cancer</b>. <br /><br />Maybe on his deathbed <b>Dr. Ferrari</b> will confess to having doped not just <b>Simeoni</b> but also <b>Armstrong</b> and others...until then...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-67987522786355156952010-01-08T23:14:51.240-05:002010-01-08T23:14:51.240-05:00LANCE HAS ALWAYS RIDDEN CLEAN. Anyone who says oth...LANCE HAS ALWAYS RIDDEN CLEAN. Anyone who says otherwise is just a jealous second-rater.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-64711877018132394892010-01-08T22:50:05.872-05:002010-01-08T22:50:05.872-05:00As a former member of the US Cycling Team I can te...As a former member of the US Cycling Team I can tell the other readers that taking drugs was very prevalent when I was racing in the 1980's thru the 1990's. These were mostly limited to pills (speed) and caffeine which at the time was not deemed to be a drug - it is in certain quantities now.<br /> <br />But it is first necessary to explain the drugs function which the article did not address.<br /><br />Without any performance enhancing 'drugs' your body is physiologically only capable of 'running' at say 80% - after that you hit the wall which is the body's natural defense mechanism so that you do not create any damage or even die.<br />What drugs do is push the natural limit from the 80% to perhaps 95% - the higher the limit is pushed the more danger that you are creating - in the sense that your body will not be able to define a barrier now and death could result if one goes over the 100% of the body's capacity.Tedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10393957541874792262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-5832880304743013142010-01-08T22:25:31.208-05:002010-01-08T22:25:31.208-05:00Really interesting article, thanks Joe. I'm a ...Really interesting article, thanks Joe. I'm a doctor but I also have a medical lab research background. Regarding EPO manufacture, it's generally produced by hamster ovary cells or similar easily maintained animal cell lines in flasks in a lab, the culture medium tapped off and EPO protein extracted by means of purification columns. As was posted, animal cells add slightly different side chains onto proteins they produce due to differences in the internal protein synthesis pathway compared to human cells. Want to beat this as a detection point? Manufacture EPO from human cells. Possible- yes. Cheap- not a hope. Easy- hell no, just the ethics to get the cells going is hard. Short answer- never going to happen. <br />There are many ways to beat current doping measures, but it's very expensive. Best way is blood testing. Urine substitution with a catheter would work, unless the cells were spun down in the lab and dna tested. Enzymes should be a no brainer for detection, as everything is destroyed. However, one could counter the analysis by saying it was a lab or collection error.<br />Blood doping? Homologous is obvious, and insanely stupid. Autologous detection requires the smart kids at ASADA to test using the RBC age related changes etc. If the blood was withdrawn only 1-3 weeks pre-test though, the detection is nearly impossible. Maybe test for citrate or heparin? This might be residual in the system post-transfusion ? But half life is less than half a day or so I think.Dr. Richnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-3456669045856665602010-01-08T17:52:49.307-05:002010-01-08T17:52:49.307-05:00The largest connection to the public is that the r...The largest connection to the public is that the race invariably takes place on public roads, and that means that at various levels the community has to sponsor or support the race. Everything from road closure permits to police presence and medical support to volunteers. That's also why it's free to attend! But you are also being bombarded by the corporate sponsors.<br /><br />The analogy that keeps coming to mind is network TV. The networks use public airwaves (they secure a portion of the spectrum) to provide "free" content to anyone willing to accept exposure to corporate messages (i.e., commercials).<br /><br />In both cases, the actors and riders do not directly derive their income from the public. But without the use of public property, there would be no way for the race or programming to exist.<br /><br />It's that connection that allows public participation in debate, I think. We own the public spaces these people race in. We have a stake in the what happens.<br /><br />If all this happens in a private velodrome where people have to pay admission, then I think that the public has a direct connection to the rider's salary and can vote with their dollars by packing the place or not attending.<br /><br />Just my opinion.John Swansonhttp://www.bikephysics.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-5227645038435926262010-01-08T17:11:24.563-05:002010-01-08T17:11:24.563-05:00Very cool discussion. I agree doping isn't an...Very cool discussion. I agree doping isn't an all-or-nothing deal. Cheating is part of the game, not just doping but all sorts of cheating. Center line violations. Deal-making. Intimidation. We know this, yet we still enjoy the sport. But the point of enforcement is to keep a check on the cheating, to reduce the incentive for extreme behavior. And as it is clearly having an effect, it's worthwhile, even if the winners are likely among the best not just at riding, but at also beating the system.djconnelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01484858820878605035noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13887692.post-935454584816319562010-01-08T15:29:06.995-05:002010-01-08T15:29:06.995-05:00I agree with Joe Papp. Please note (to others) tha...I agree with Joe Papp. Please note (to others) that the last couple of strong opinions in <i>italics</i> on fraud and embezzlement are mine, not Joe's. Those opinions are shared by a lot of people though. There is public money in winner's prizes.Ron Georgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18394865788996482667noreply@blogger.com